Cliff LyonRacism Thriving in America
…and the loud approval by White America over the recent Supreme Court decision in Parents Involved in Community Schools vs. Seattle School District gives us a big hint how they do it.
I note that Mr. Staheli’s argument in the post directly below is that somehow this court decision vindicates the premise that the Democrats are in fact “race baiting”. Follows is his unbelievable conclusion. It is shocking.
…for some liberals, Brown wasn’t about freedom of choice. It was a confirmation of their deepest inner secret–that they don’t care about the children, but rather that they will use any wedge they can find to destroy relations between the various races in America. All as a means to gain greater government control.
Let me see if I understand Frank’s argument; Brown v. Board of Education is responsible for race problems like the recent news item below BECAUSE black and white students are on the same campus, and that’s why liberal Democrats support such things because it serves our “secret” goal of more government control? Did I get that?
In September 2006, a group of African American high school students in Jena, Louisiana, asked the school for permission to sit beneath a “whites only†shade tree. There was an unwritten rule that blacks couldn’t sit beneath the tree. The school said they didn’t care where students sat. The next day, students arrived at school to see three nooses (in school colors) hanging from the tree…
The boys who hung the nooses were suspended from school for a few days. The school administration chalked it up as a harmless prank, but Jena’s black population didn’t take it so lightly. Fights and unrest started breaking out at school. The District Attorney, Reed Walters, was called in to directly address black students at the school and told them all he could “end their life with a stroke of the pen.â€Black students were assaulted at white parties. A white man drew a loaded rifle on three black teens at a local convenience store. (They wrestled it from him and ran away.) Someone tried to burn down the school, and on December 4th, a fight broke out that led to six black students being charged with attempted murder. To his word, the D.A. pushed for maximum charges, which carry sentences of eighty years. Four of the six are being tried as adults (ages 17 & 18) and two are juveniles….
July 1st, 2007 at 2:13 pm
After reading Frank’s post, I am left, with all due respect, with the impression that Frank has never read the case Brown v. Board of Educ. If, on the other hand, he has read the case, he read it with an enormous misunderstanding concerning application of the equal protection clause of the 14th Amend. and the rational basis and strict scrutiny tests used to permit laws that might otherwise run afoul of the 14th Amend.
Frank, are you sure you didn’t mean for your post to go to RedState.com?
July 1st, 2007 at 4:14 pm
Neph; you on the tag team? Publicly based education as it has been allowed to evolve is making imbeciles out of perfectly intelligent people. Most public education these days is socially based in nature, or at least as backdrop for most things discussed.
School is no longer about excellence, it is about forming the clay into an acceptable platform for working and remaining obedient to the status quo. At 12 years current education in America is a sentence…and the outcome…30th Fucking Place!
July 1st, 2007 at 4:49 pm
Cliff,
Please.
Read my post again, try to understand it, and then please rewrite this post. Because your wildly flung assumptions are not even close. How can you possibly think that I would condone a “whites only” tree? You really need to seek to understand before making such accusations. It is beneath your dignity to make the attack on me that you have.
I am surprised at you. Perhaps it was because you didn’t read about the current case that the Supreme Court was deciding.
I thought you invited me to contribute to this forum because you truly cared about and seriously tried to understand others’ points of view, not because I was your token conservative whipping boy.
I guess I was wrong.
Nephi,
Yes, I have read the case. I’ve also seen the movie. 5 Supreme Court justices agree with me, while 4 agree with you, so it is obviously very controversial. I suggest you start by trying to understand my point of view. You and Cliff sound as desperate as a bunch of right-wing conservatives who are equally sure of the untenability of their position.
I have a better suggestion. Let’s stop calling each other names, and let’s try to get to the meat of each others’ arguments. I have made no claim as to complete infallibility, but I’m afraid with Cliff’s attack on me and complete unwillingness to try and understand my perspective, that he has made a de facto claim as to his.
Hopefully I’m wrong about Cliff, and hopefully you’re not going to get all diatribey on me either.
What I’ve enjoyed (usually) about One Utah is that different points of view get respected. Well, I’m feeling no respect as of now.
I would be glad to answer specific questions, and I would love to hear how and why you disagree with me, but not in a condescending matter (although you’re free to do so.)
July 1st, 2007 at 5:46 pm
I’m sorry Frank,
What do I misunderstand about this statement: “some liberals,…will use any wedge they can find to destroy relations between the various races in America”
Well, A “whites only tree” seems to me to evidence of “some liberals” goal “to destroy relations between the various races in America”.
I didn’t say you approved of it. But it seems to me basically said “some liberals” exacerbate it purposefully in order to pursue the greater goal of government control.
But rather than misinterpreting my post as accusing YOU of being a racist, (which I have certainly NOT), why don’t you either back off your ridiculous conclusions about democrats and “some liberals” (because you can’t give one example really), or explain why Brown v Board is racist.
Or what about this statement, “Unfortunately, black voters have overwhelmingly positive opinions of the two presidential candidates who are trying the hardest to destroy black upward mobility in America–Barak Obama and Hillary Clinton”
Which one of our dear OneUtah readers did you expect to buy THAT statement?
I do want you here Frank, to provide rationale and honest balance, but today, you seem to be avoiding both.
I have read your post and comments over and over, and I just can’t ignore what YOU WROTE in spite of some other point you meant.
July 1st, 2007 at 6:06 pm
Thank you for clarifying. I share your passion for removing racism from America.
I gave you good examples of racists: Jesse jackson, Al Sharpton, and Hillary Clinton. You didn’t misunderstand anything about “some liberals,…will use any wedge they can find to destroy relations between the various races in Americaâ€. Hillary gave an excellent example of how to foment the problem of racism rather than help to fix it with her emotional statement about AIDS/HIV.
I just wrote another post about subsidies and government control that hopefully helps you understand how I could think that some politicians seek to divide in order to gain control. It is my opinion that Obama, Clinton, Biden, and others prove by their statements at Howard University the other night that they are not willing to be part of the solution, but instead enjoy fomenting the problem the enhance their own popularity and power. If I insinuated “all Democrats”, I apologize. I didn’t mean that. I know of several democrats who do not feel this way. This is why I said “SOME liberals”. For fairness I believe that some conservatives exacerbate problems to perpetuate their power as well.
Nor did I say that Brown v Board is racist. I ARRIVED AT THE EXACT OPPOSITE CONCLUSION. What I did say is that if someone can interpret Brown to mean that we can force blacks and whites to integrate against their (black and white) wishes, then that is as racist as the segregation whites of the 1950’s south were.
July 1st, 2007 at 6:21 pm
All right you two, let me step in here and say that to the extent we are mongrelized, we are no longer racist. Me? I have achieved full mongrelization thanks in part to my ancestors lack of hesitance when it came to tapping or being tapped by members of which ever race they happened to be tresspassing apon. It has worked out pretty well until the damn Dutch started working out thier crazy ideas. Curse them!
July 1st, 2007 at 6:21 pm
Just for the record, the title of your post on Simple is “Brown v Board of Education Was About Racism After Allâ€
Somewhere along the way, race quotas started getting called racism. It was a purposeful and deliberate play by the Rovians. Maybe you were unaware then as you maybe still be now.
Whatever the case, you used that play and played that card and I could not in good conscience let you get away with it.
Does that make sense? I believe Richard addressed this point head on in his one and only response to you.
July 1st, 2007 at 6:46 pm
I didn’t hear Rove use that term. I don’t listen much to what Rove says. I apologize if the title of the post on SUMP was misleading. I didn’t think that a careful reading of the post would lead you to the conclusion that I think Brown was a racist decision. I do not think that.
I think it is racist to foment racism. I think the statements by liberals (that I have already discussed) are racist for that reason. I think forcing people to integrate is racist, and it can only hope to have detrimental effects. It is a sad history that our country has of slavery and racism–no question. But the only solution beyond what Brown decided–and the enforcement thereof can effectuate–must come from within ourselves. We have to develop a public forum wherein we can say “I’m sorry” rather than “I hate you.”
July 2nd, 2007 at 4:58 am
Richard, I will admit use of the word racist to describe race-based admission was used before Rove, but his crew adpoted it from the far right and put it front and center when they put Colin Powell up in the 200 election.
I notice you haven’t changed the title of the post. If it is as misleading as I think we both agree, why not just change it, less one accuse YOU of being as inflammatory as Hillary?
July 2nd, 2007 at 7:56 am
The problem is, I don’t think it is misleading. All you have to do is read the entire post, and then the conclusions you jump to will be much easier to reach without spraining an ankle or something.
July 2nd, 2007 at 8:01 am
The title of the post is inflammatory, and indicative of what you speak of Frank. The idea that liberals would use any wedge issue, including race to further their political goals. It’s right up there with doing nothing about bush, by that I mean impeachment, so their political fortunes can be improved. Meanwhile soldiers, and civilians die, in a war almost all of representation is responsible for.
Playing the race card is used by both sides, whether actively in seeking support from a minority, or in motivated the base of either party. It is pathetic, and what I read here is simply the death of our Republic. There is no chance that configured as the parties are, the position to benefit politically from divisive issues without much concern for the well being and well being of American citizens, that America is a long term prospect.
Let’s remember that this is a blog-page, and despite any aspirations to the serious, it is entertainment.
Frank, you are not wrong, for as long as I have known Cliff, there is no real interest in getting along with conservatives, as he generally finds them repugnant, though in his own life, is as republican as the day is long, when it comes to his own money. Aren’t we all?, or we’re broke.
B vs BE is viable and right in theory, as long as kids are being educated. If they are not, integration is meaningless in regard to education, ans only serves a social function which supporters obviously feel is more important than your children being functionally literate.